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	<title>Comments on: 8th street construction update</title>
	<link>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/</link>
	<description>A blog about Downtown Jacksonville, Springfield, LaVilla, Brooklyn, the Southbank and San Marco.</description>
	<pubDate>Tue, 06 Jan 2009 11:28:44 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.2</generator>
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		<title>By: Urban Jacksonville - News and events for Downtown Jacksonville, Springfield, La Villa, Brooklyn, the Southbank and San Marco. &#187; Blog Archive &#187; 8th Street Construction Update, June 2006</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-739</link>
		<dc:creator>Urban Jacksonville - News and events for Downtown Jacksonville, Springfield, La Villa, Brooklyn, the Southbank and San Marco. &#187; Blog Archive &#187; 8th Street Construction Update, June 2006</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Jun 2006 11:53:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-739</guid>
		<description>[...] The sidewalks on both sides of 8th street are gone. This is the only visible difference since my last update on the 8th Street construction. I have no doubt there is more going just beneath the surface, infrastructre and all that. The city sure hasn&#8217;t provided a timely update on the website devoted to citywide road and infrastructure improvements: The Better Jacksonville Plan. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] The sidewalks on both sides of 8th street are gone. This is the only visible difference since my last update on the 8th Street construction. I have no doubt there is more going just beneath the surface, infrastructre and all that. The city sure hasn&#8217;t provided a timely update on the website devoted to citywide road and infrastructure improvements: The Better Jacksonville Plan. [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: stephen dare</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-622</link>
		<dc:creator>stephen dare</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 May 2006 16:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-622</guid>
		<description>lol anonymous,

I meant to say crappy sheet rock and wet pine.....

end of the day, hurricane provided, not much difference.

It will be quite a challenge for the majority of the new construction taking place in this (and every other city) to remain standing for fifty more years.

The plaster, brick, and oak skeletons of the traditional homes kept them intact for hundreds of years, with care.

Its hard to argue that there hasnt been a crappification of construction over the past 40 years, especially in the home markets.  Andrew didnt really destroy the old neighborhoods of south florida, but it was catastrophic to the new construction of Homestead.

Just an observation on the relative merits of old encumbered structures.

Stephen Dare.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>lol anonymous,</p>
<p>I meant to say crappy sheet rock and wet pine&#8230;..</p>
<p>end of the day, hurricane provided, not much difference.</p>
<p>It will be quite a challenge for the majority of the new construction taking place in this (and every other city) to remain standing for fifty more years.</p>
<p>The plaster, brick, and oak skeletons of the traditional homes kept them intact for hundreds of years, with care.</p>
<p>Its hard to argue that there hasnt been a crappification of construction over the past 40 years, especially in the home markets.  Andrew didnt really destroy the old neighborhoods of south florida, but it was catastrophic to the new construction of Homestead.</p>
<p>Just an observation on the relative merits of old encumbered structures.</p>
<p>Stephen Dare.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-621</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 May 2006 15:41:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-621</guid>
		<description>Easy, nobody is rebuilding with "crappy cardboard and wet pine".</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Easy, nobody is rebuilding with &#8220;crappy cardboard and wet pine&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: stephen dare</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-620</link>
		<dc:creator>stephen dare</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 May 2006 08:16:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-620</guid>
		<description>heres a transcript of what was on four.....
http://www.news4jax.com/news/9156167/detail.html

Like many of the old buildings, the building was condemned.  We were in the process of selling the building to a contractor (maybe a week before closing...)
We had an engineering report and an appraisal that show the building, although roofless was sound.

In any case the new owner was a general contractor whose plan was to convert the building into a home for his daughter and to rent the downstairs out for office and cafe space.

We spent a lot of time finding a new owner----meaning one who would guarantee in the contract the preservation of the building.

Derek Igou, of the property safety division assures me that the damage was accidental, and I have a pretty high opinion of Derek, so I would hesitate before making any claims to the contrary.

The building was apparently set to have a hearing regarding its seaworthiness and the city's desire to demolish it, but the hearing had not happened and we had not been notified.

Apparently I am very difficult to find.  Although I can't imagine that I would be difficult to find at all.

Lakelander it IS a shame that there isnt any strength in the historic preservation designation.  The city has found several ways around the requirements of preservation, and I can tell you from personal experience on the ground that the parts of the city which plan and execute the demolitions could give one flying flip about historic importance.

One of the lunkheads on the ground told me that the building deserved to be destroyed on the basis of it being in a crime district.

When I responded that buildings, largely didnt commit crimes, this seemed to be exactly what he would expect from a commie loving preservationist like myself.

Preservation and the importance of it just are not a universal value in this town.  

The easy thing is to tear stuff down and rebuild with crappy cardboard and wet pine.

sucks.

Stephen Dare</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>heres a transcript of what was on four&#8230;..<br />
<a href="http://www.news4jax.com/news/9156167/detail.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.news4jax.com/news/9156167/detail.html</a></p>
<p>Like many of the old buildings, the building was condemned.  We were in the process of selling the building to a contractor (maybe a week before closing&#8230;)<br />
We had an engineering report and an appraisal that show the building, although roofless was sound.</p>
<p>In any case the new owner was a general contractor whose plan was to convert the building into a home for his daughter and to rent the downstairs out for office and cafe space.</p>
<p>We spent a lot of time finding a new owner&#8212;-meaning one who would guarantee in the contract the preservation of the building.</p>
<p>Derek Igou, of the property safety division assures me that the damage was accidental, and I have a pretty high opinion of Derek, so I would hesitate before making any claims to the contrary.</p>
<p>The building was apparently set to have a hearing regarding its seaworthiness and the city&#8217;s desire to demolish it, but the hearing had not happened and we had not been notified.</p>
<p>Apparently I am very difficult to find.  Although I can&#8217;t imagine that I would be difficult to find at all.</p>
<p>Lakelander it IS a shame that there isnt any strength in the historic preservation designation.  The city has found several ways around the requirements of preservation, and I can tell you from personal experience on the ground that the parts of the city which plan and execute the demolitions could give one flying flip about historic importance.</p>
<p>One of the lunkheads on the ground told me that the building deserved to be destroyed on the basis of it being in a crime district.</p>
<p>When I responded that buildings, largely didnt commit crimes, this seemed to be exactly what he would expect from a commie loving preservationist like myself.</p>
<p>Preservation and the importance of it just are not a universal value in this town.  </p>
<p>The easy thing is to tear stuff down and rebuild with crappy cardboard and wet pine.</p>
<p>sucks.</p>
<p>Stephen Dare</p>
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		<title>By: thelakelander</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-619</link>
		<dc:creator>thelakelander</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 May 2006 05:41:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-619</guid>
		<description>I can't for the life of me understand why JEA would tear down the building, when the owner had plans to restore it.  What gives them the right to rip down private property without the owner's consent or even letting him know what was going on?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can&#8217;t for the life of me understand why JEA would tear down the building, when the owner had plans to restore it.  What gives them the right to rip down private property without the owner&#8217;s consent or even letting him know what was going on?</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-618</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 May 2006 05:14:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-618</guid>
		<description>Someone was telling me that they saw you on the news, Stephen.  Their account was completely different than what you just said, tho.  I can't put any faith in the heresay and therefore take your word for granted.  As for my opinion on the matter, that building had no roof, was half covered with a bathroom tile facade, and had a rusty sign that was in need of restoration.  In all, a lot of work.  I can only imagine a developer would demolish it rather than doing all the necessary structural and cosmetic repairs.  

And, the story I got from my not so official source was that the building was condemned long ago and was _intentionally_ torn down by JEA.  The project scope was to replace all water pipes and re-pave 8th street.  I don't know why replacing water pipes require demolition of condemned structures, but who knows.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Someone was telling me that they saw you on the news, Stephen.  Their account was completely different than what you just said, tho.  I can&#8217;t put any faith in the heresay and therefore take your word for granted.  As for my opinion on the matter, that building had no roof, was half covered with a bathroom tile facade, and had a rusty sign that was in need of restoration.  In all, a lot of work.  I can only imagine a developer would demolish it rather than doing all the necessary structural and cosmetic repairs.  </p>
<p>And, the story I got from my not so official source was that the building was condemned long ago and was _intentionally_ torn down by JEA.  The project scope was to replace all water pipes and re-pave 8th street.  I don&#8217;t know why replacing water pipes require demolition of condemned structures, but who knows.</p>
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		<title>By: thelakelander</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-617</link>
		<dc:creator>thelakelander</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 May 2006 03:30:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-617</guid>
		<description>If there's not going to be a committment to save the historic commercial structures of Springfield, then what's the purpose of calling it a historic district in the first place?  Lets go ahead and get it over with and mow the entire corridor down Detriot style and grow an urban prarie!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If there&#8217;s not going to be a committment to save the historic commercial structures of Springfield, then what&#8217;s the purpose of calling it a historic district in the first place?  Lets go ahead and get it over with and mow the entire corridor down Detriot style and grow an urban prarie!</p>
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		<title>By: stephen dare</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-616</link>
		<dc:creator>stephen dare</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 May 2006 01:21:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-616</guid>
		<description>i wish i didnt privately agree with anonymous.

the city didnt want any of those structures to remain standing.

after practically (well, actually) calling craig a liar in print on the subject of his city involved building collapses, i then had to go and apologize to him for doing so (....which i would almost rather do anything else than.)

it seems like you would have to be pretty damned forgetful not to realize that you were ripping out a foundation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i wish i didnt privately agree with anonymous.</p>
<p>the city didnt want any of those structures to remain standing.</p>
<p>after practically (well, actually) calling craig a liar in print on the subject of his city involved building collapses, i then had to go and apologize to him for doing so (&#8230;.which i would almost rather do anything else than.)</p>
<p>it seems like you would have to be pretty damned forgetful not to realize that you were ripping out a foundation.</p>
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		<title>By: joey marchy</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-615</link>
		<dc:creator>joey marchy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 May 2006 00:18:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-615</guid>
		<description>Interesting point of view:

&lt;I&gt;so should the property taxes. clearly those lots are more valuable now than they were with pesky historic structures so easily neglected.&lt;/I&gt;

I would never think something that nefarious could be in the works...

Stephen,
Maybe you can hook me up with some of the photos and we can post them on the blog.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting point of view:</p>
<p><i>so should the property taxes. clearly those lots are more valuable now than they were with pesky historic structures so easily neglected.</i></p>
<p>I would never think something that nefarious could be in the works&#8230;</p>
<p>Stephen,<br />
Maybe you can hook me up with some of the photos and we can post them on the blog.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-614</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 May 2006 21:19:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.urbanjacksonville.info/2006/05/09/8th-street-construction-update/#comment-614</guid>
		<description>accidental, like the one at 8th and market, the one next to the klutho, the one at 8th and pearl. 

watch where you step. i bet some accidental mix use condos go up at all these spots. so should the property taxes. clearly those lots are more valuable now than they were with pesky historic structures so easily neglected.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>accidental, like the one at 8th and market, the one next to the klutho, the one at 8th and pearl. </p>
<p>watch where you step. i bet some accidental mix use condos go up at all these spots. so should the property taxes. clearly those lots are more valuable now than they were with pesky historic structures so easily neglected.</p>
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