Urban Jacksonville

Someone placed a lined rubbish bin on the lot and still they throw trash around. Where is the property owner?

Absentee landlordism. JSO will treat the symptoms. Overpaying for the property is the only cure. Sadly.

i totally just noticed this the other day…..didn’t know how long that guy had been living there…..i thiought that had been there for a long time and i was just now noticing it?…..that dude also sits across the street at the sketch mart and just yells as cars go by, with his hands up in the air….DEFINITELY f’ing crazy….

From your description I’m guessing that the man has a mental disability. Such is the case for the majority of homeless people in the U.S. The next biggest group of homeless is people with varying substance addictions.

The proper way to “clean up” the situation is to offer the man a nice place to stay with free food and free medical treatment for his condition (whatever it may be). Unfortunately, such places are rare in the U.S. since the majority of state-run homeless shelters are setup to segregate the homeless from the rest of the population (with no real treatment) while the majority of rest appear to be setup with the intention of converting said homeless to some religion.

Once the man was being treated for his condition and slowly being re-integrated into society (may not be possible), you’d clean up the area and fine/charge the property owner for the cost (of the cleanup, not of the man’s care).

Unfortunately this ideal situation will never happen because it is pretty hard to convince a mentally unstable person to get treatment (even if it is free) and you can’t force him (free country).

Also I’d like to point out that “mental handicap” doesn’t mean he’s dangerous or completely unsociable. He might have Tourette’s syndrome which leaves an otherwise sane mind with odd behaviors which may *appear* to be violent, but they’re really just the result of a mis-firing of neurons in the brain. Shouting and knocking over old milk bottles can be kind of like an epileptic seizure for someone with Tourette’s with the exception that it is going on most of the time.

I say that because I don’t want anyone to think that this guy is a “danger to society”. He very well may be, but not knowing I’d have to give him the benefit of the doubt before you sick the police on him.

-Riskable
http://riskable.com
“I have a license to kill -9″

Riskable, I think you are missing the point. While many of your points are valid and I agree with what you are saying, we are not sicking the police on the man, but rather the situation.

It is unacceptable to have people squatting in a residential neighborhood, or anywhere for that matter. I am more interested in shutting down whoever allows this to go on, rather than the people living there.

I’d also like to point out that another mental condition which has similar symptoms is schizophrenia. He’d have to be diagnosed by a professional.

The reason why I think it may be Tourette’s is… Well… If you have a disorder that prevented you from integrating into society and you think there’s very little you can do about it, wouldn’t you get a little frustrated and start kicking over milk bottles and start throwing a towel around? You might even take out your frustrations by shouting at cars =)

-Riskable
http://riskable.com
“I have a license to kill -9″

joeymarchy,

I see your point and I agree. It is just that my first inclination in such situations to look at the human element, then to examine the societal problem at large.

-Riskable
http://riskable.com
“I have a license to kill -9″

Riskable sounds like they have an excuse for anything. Regardless of what the Government does and does not provide for the homeless (which I think there is a lot more does that does not in this county specifically) there is still no reason for the lawful citizens of Springfield have to endure such squalor.

Main Street renewal at it’s best!

It may seem rather harsh, and I am somehwat disgusted at myself for even thinking this, but the more things like this occur, the less people are going to buy $600,000 houses in Springfield, which means that I (who currently rents) might actually be able to afford a house in the neighborhood I love in a few years when purchasing is an option for me. And, seriously, with things like this just 2 blocks away, how can SRG justify charging $500,000 or so for a home? I mean the houses are beautiful, but are people going to pay San Marco/Avondale money for houses which have crazy squatter guy as a not-so-distant neighbor?

Who needs to pay 400k for a Loft on Main when you can squat a spot across the street for free?

He isn’t homeless. He’s a wayward Hitchhiker; he has his towel and that’s all that’s important.

RIP Douglas Adams.

Oh, Riskable, if you read the Emergency Services and Homeless Coalition’s report on homelessness and followed up with any research (or perhaps lived with these people), you would see that the real problem in Jacksonville is with greedy, absentee landowners as Joey said (this is a great example of our Government inaction), giving the homeless places to squat (and not giving squat about it) and a lack of policing — the police are no longer even suggesting to the homeless that they find help at any of the MULTITUDE of shelters or other homeless resources in Jacksonville. Once you spend time with them and find out how many of our “homeless” are actually able-boddied junkies perhaps your view will sour a little. Guys like this towel swinger are in the minority of what Springfield is forced to endure.

What if he isn’t homeless, but it is his property? In most cities, the police would eventually deal with him. Sad situation.

The property is owned by Petra Management (Chris Hionides-owner). Mary Farwell is the manager of Mr. Hionides’s properties under the Petra company. Mary’s phone is 241-1151. Her address is 1817 3rd St. N Jacksonville Beach. Mr. Hionides’s work phone # is 241-1501 (Neptune Beach) He is currently in Greece and will not be back until August 1st.

Petra owns a bunch of vacant properties on Main St in Springfield and also owns stuff in downtown.

BTW
I prefer the term ‘Urban Outdoorsman” to homeless

Thanks for adding the info, Kathryn, never been to the city. It’s still a sad situation. Most of the mentally ill people, truly don’t have the mentally to do things “the right way”. Many of the homeless aren’t mentally ill, tho’ getting involved in the system that is suppossed to help one get off the streets, can lead one to craziness.

Good work Kathryn.

Just relocate the guy to the downtown library; that’s a pretty nice homeless shelter, from what I hear :)

Grimly Fiendish wrote:

He isn’t homeless. He’s a wayward Hitchhiker; he has his towel and that’s all that’s important.
RIP Douglas Adams.
Oh, Riskable, if you read the Emergency Services and Homeless Coalition’s report on homelessness and followed up with any research (or perhaps lived with these people), you would see that the real problem in Jacksonville is with greedy, absentee landowners as Joey said (this is a great example of our Government inaction), giving the homeless places to squat (and not giving squat about it) and a lack of policing — the police are no longer even suggesting to the homeless that they find help at any of the MULTITUDE of shelters or other homeless resources in Jacksonville. Once you spend time with them and find out how many of our “homeless” are actually able-boddied junkies perhaps your view will sour a little. Guys like this towel swinger are in the minority of what Springfield is forced to endure.”

Umm… That is a lot to respond to:

Firstly, the two articles you linked to say pretty much exactly the same thing I did: “Most have mental or physical problems. 53 percent said they had a disability and 37 percent said they had been hospitalized or given medication for mental problems.” and their suggested solution is to build “800 units of permanent housing for the chronically homeless — with counselors to help their mental and physical disabilities and their drug addictions — over the next five years.”

To quote myself, the solution to the problem of having this homeless guy “blight” your neighborhood is, “a nice place to stay with free food and free medical treatment for his condition”… Sounds like the same damn thing to me. Except my solution includes real treatment instead of “counselors” (think about how useful your guidance counselor was in high school).

Secondly, a land owner that does not care for their property should be fined–and regularly if their property is causing urban blight. Allowing trash to build up on that property is unacceptable–I completely agree with that. However, if there is no sign on the property that says “NO TRESPASSING” the police really can’t remove someone from it. It isn’t in their charter to randomly pick up unsightly/annoying homeless people for merely being unsightly and annoying.

Thirdly, substance addiction is a disease and it most certainly can prevent people from working. If you’re homeless and addicted to drugs, it isn’t that easy to just pick up and start working somewhere. First of all, to get most jobs you need a background check (you think lots of drug arrests is going to be OK with any given employer?), the ability to shower daily, and a set of clean clothes (with some way to wash them regularly). Then you need to make enough money to pay for your drugs, your food, your transportation, and maybe after half a decade of working a low-paying job you might be able to upgrade your life to something better. Hopefully by then you’ll have worked out your addiction.

Without a strong circle of friends and family, working your way out of homelessness is an extremely difficult task. Is it any wonder that a lot of these people resort to a life of crime? I have to wonder if we need something like the witness protection program for homeless veterans so we can sweep them off to better lives.

The study you linked to mentioned that homelessness is growing due to low-wage workers being priced out of the housing market. I have to wonder how much certain factors go into creating such a problem:

* School system failing kids (so they drop out)
* Lack of the minimum wage increasing with inflation/price indexes/housing
* Cultural issues that create single mothers who end up raising mal-adjusted children.
* Rising health care costs that force people into bankruptcy (and homelessness)… Which creates a drain on the economy.
* Middle income knowledge jobs being moved over seas.
* Rising energy prices.
* The increasing division of wealth in this country (top 10% own 71% of the wealth while the bottom 40% own 1%).
* Businesses utilizing illegal immigrants for labor to undercut minimum wage.

…and that’s just the tip of the ice burg. Hopefully a new round of Democrats will soon be elected and social issues will once again be a focus of our government.

-Riskable
http://riskable.com
“I have a license to kill -9″

This kind of scene is exactly why I didn’t move to Springfield a couple of years ago. I gave Springfield 5 years to turn around. I’m adding another 5 to that. The city doesn’t seem to want anyone but homeless people downtown. They are welcomed with open arms. But people having a good time are regarded with cloudy suspicion and surveillance! Maybe Petra-man has a master plan for the urban squatters! They sure ain’t payin no rent, no how!

* School system failing kids (so they drop out)
- Government schools failing? nooo.. let’s spend more tax payer money
* Lack of the minimum wage increasing with inflation/price indexes/housing
- Yes lets make those just above minimum wage poorer. Matter of fact it’s an excellent idea, everyone gets a percentage of pay decrease with increase in minimum wage. To boot, it’s an excellent way of increasing inflation unnecessarily.
* Cultural issues that create single mothers who end up raising mal-adjusted children.
- Cultural issues create single mothers? Those single mothers raise mal-adjusted children? Wow, I must be lucky to have survived such an ordeal.
* Rising health care costs that force people into bankruptcy (and homelessness)… Which creates a drain on the economy.
- Unfortunately a lowering of health care costs can create a drain on expected life spans.
* Middle income knowledge jobs being moved over seas.
- Outsourcing again? Good thing Middle income jobs are being imported from overseas also. 4.9% unemployment but I’m sure all those new jobs are McJobs. Right..
* Rising energy prices.
- Thank China’s increasing need for Oil.
* The increasing division of wealth in this country (top 10% own 71% of the wealth while the bottom 40% own 1%).
- The same top 10% that pay 50% of all taxes that fund the bottom 40%’s social programs. The top 50% of wage earners in this country pay for 93% of all taxes.
* Businesses utilizing illegal immigrants for labor to undercut minimum wage.
- 4.9% unemployment, that is almost considered FULL employment. However, I am against illegal immigrant labor.

“Hopefully a new round of Democrats will soon be elected and social issues will once again be a focus …”

Social issues are probably getting more focus than they should as it is. That homeless man could walk a couple of miles to two shelters, one provided by charity, and the other the city. But he probably refuses the treatment. How are Democrats going to change that? …or Republicans for that matter?

The city should fine the landlord until something is done to prevent the squatting.

Riskable obviously has a political agenda here. I love the excuses for why people do something they shouldn’t do, pointing fingers & shifting blame. Got to hate those pesky little facts, huh??

Rampant said… (paraphrased for space and clarity)

Regarding my comment that school systems are failing kids: “More government money spent on schools would be a waste.” I completely agree! So that eliminates 1 of 1,000,000 things we could do to try to fix our failing school system. I’m really getting sick of straw man arguments.

Regarding my comment that the minimum wage has not increased with the rate of inflation/price indexes/cost of living: “Increasing the minimum wage would make those who make marginally more than minimum wage poorer. Raising minimum wage increases inflation.” If what you said was true, we should have experienced an increase in inflation between 1996 (when minimum wage was last increased) and 1998 (two years should be enough time for it to set in). Let’s look at some historical inflation numbers…

1990-1992: Inflation 7.35%
1992-1994: Inflation 5.63%
1994-1996: Inflation 5.87%
1996-1998: Inflation 3.89%
1998-2000: Inflation 5.64%
2000-2002: Inflation 4.47%

Whoah now! What the heck could have possibly happened in 1996 that reduced inflation so much?!? Is it possible that increasing the minimum wage from $4.25/hour to $5.15/hour might have had a role to play? I think so. The interaction between wages and inflation is a lot more complex that you think. If we were to increase it from $5.15 to, say, $20/hour I would be on your side of the issue… That would drastically hurt the economy and would increase inflation. However, keeping the minimum wage set at a rate tied to the cost of living doesn’t really have that much play because the number of workers at that low end of the pay scale and their influence on the economy is so small that it doesn’t make much of a dent. It just isn’t a big enough piece of the pie.

For reference, the primary reason for the reduction in inflation in 1996-1998 wasn’t the increase in the minimum wage. It was a large amount of capital investment from the stockpiles of businesses/the rich into the technology sector which enabled the economy to do so well (and create the bubble).

Regarding my comment that cultural issues are generating single mothers in poverty conditions which makes for a piss-poor child-rearing environment: “I grew up under a single mother and I’m not mal-adjusted!” I really have no idea how to respond to your comment. Would you have had a better childhood if you had a father around that cared about you? I’d say so. I’d also say that statistically speaking, children of single mothers are much less likely to become “contributing members of society.”

Regarding my comment that health care costs are putting a drain on the economy (which adds to homelessness): “Lowering the cost of health care lowers life expectancy.” Besides being a bizarre thing to say, you are incorrect. Have a look at this:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/hea_lif_exp_at_bir_yea_tot_pop-expectancy-birth-years-total-population

It is the life expectancy statistics for 187 nations of the world. The United States (having the highest cost of health care) is ranked 31st. The 30 countries above us all have socialized health care systems. Look it up, they really do all have social health care systems.

I assume that if you respond to this argument you’ll change the subject to something like, “But our health care system is #1!” If you do try to make such a statement, look up your facts… We’re not doing that great.

Regarding my comment that knowledge jobs moving over seas can contribute to homelessness: “Outsourcing doesn’t have a negative impact at all. In fact, unemployment is at 4.9%” To that I say, “Ahh yes, but if you lose your $18/hour job to an over seas worker and you take a job making $10/hour while you try to find a new/better job are you really better off?” Go to places like Costco, Home Depot, CompUSA, and Best Buy and ask the people working there what they used to do. You’ll hear that quite a number of them had their jobs outsourced and they’re working for basic income or the health care (in the case of Costco and Home Depot).

Regarding my comment that energy prices are increasing: “It is China’s fault” Umm… Not yet. Right now the major price increases have been from speculators (who raise prices on the tiniest little rumor in the middle east) and natural disasters.

Regarding my comment that the distribution of wealth is a problem: “The richest of the rich pay half of all taxes. The top 50% pay 93%. In other words, those poor people aren’t contributing their fair share!” Are you suggesting that the solution to the distribution of wealth problem is to make the poor earn more so they can pay more in taxes? If so, I agree with you!

Regarding my comment that illegal immigrant laborers are undercutting minimum wage and this hurts the poor: “Unemployment is great right now, so your comment carries no weight.” I would say, “fair enough” but for the fact that unemployment doesn’t tell the whole story. I have two things to say in this regard: 1) Hiring illegals and paying them next to nothing could be considered inhumane and I think the only way to solve this problem is with strict enforcement of the business owners that do this. Preferably with short-term imprisonment and auctioning off their assets. 2) Paying citizens to do the same work benefits the economy (and society in general!) more than the cost savings gained by hiring illegals to do the same work without the same protections and benefits that are required by law for full citizens.

-Riskable
http://riskable.com
“I have a license to kill -9″

John said,

Riskable obviously has a political agenda here. I love the excuses for why people do something they shouldn’t do, pointing fingers & shifting blame. Got to hate those pesky little facts, huh??

Firstly, this article is political in nature. Expect comments in regards to politics!

Secondly, define what you mean by a “political agenda”. If I see injustices in this world I try my best to get to the bottom of them and understand their causes. I probably sound like some sort of “bleeding heart” to you, but know this: A bleeding heart is better than no heart at all.

To hack at the roots of this evil: You see a homeless man causing blight upon the landscape and call for justice. If the man and the blight are removed, do you declare that justice has been served? I say nay, justice has not been served. The blight has not been removed, it has simply become less visible. The man is still homeless.

-Riskable
http://riskable.com
“I have a license to kill -9″

“If I see injustices in this world I try my best to get to the bottom of them and understand their causes.”

That’s laudable. Keep it up. But some friendly advice…when commenting on someone else’s blog, keep your comments brief, concise and on-topic. Otherwise you lose the audience after the first or second paragraph. Peace.

Riskable,
Irony is not lost with the straw man comment.

Moving along,to inflation.

An increase in wages in excess of any increase in productivity, can be a cause of inflation. Unless your insinuating that increasing min wage does indeed increase productivity, inflation can be a result. An increase in of minimum wage will create a decrease of the purchasing power of an individual who does not receive a matching increase. I will grant you, that amount may not be easily measurable as the percentage depending on the increase and the result in productivity.

To suggest as you have that the raise of minimum wages have a bearing on statistics of lowering inflation, without taking other economic factors into consideration is absurd. You, yourself don’t rule out that an increase could cause inflation. You stated it’s not enough to make a dent. I never said it would be greatly measurable or that it could cause hyperinflation, just that it is what it is.

Single mothers

You said,”I’d also say that statistically speaking, children of single mothers are much less likely to become ‘contributing members of society.’” See, this is stereotyping and ignoring the real problem. The statistically speaking is misleading. What it should say is, “statistically single mothers are of lower economic status thus the children have a lower probability of becoming “contributing members of society.” Single mothers isn’t the issue, economic environment is.

Health Care… you may have a point, not my area. However, I still do not see it being the responsibility of government to provide healthcare. Maybe I could be persuaded, but doubt it.

Outsourcing

For the scenario you provided my main question, ” Why have you given up? Why have you settled for a lower paying job? Can you not find a job in a different sector or location.” If the well goes dry, you don’t stop at the first puddle you see. Why do people give up and decide to stay at the dry well and look for puddles.

Distribution of wealth

You said, “Are you suggesting that the solution to the distribution of wealth problem is to make the poor earn more so they can pay more in taxes?” No, I don’t suggest we “make” poor people earn more. I suggest that taxes should be equal to one’s wealth. EQUALITY not punishment. Equal rights, Equal taxes, Equal representation.

Illegal Immigrant Labor

Inhumane? So what do you consider wages that they would be paid in their home country? Is it fair to pay them less than min wage, no. Inhumane is an awfully long stretch for being paid more than you would be in your own home country. I think we both agree illegal immigration must be dealt with.

This post is in no way political in nature. It is a community awareness article. Only the comments related to the post have skewed political.

joeymarchy wrote, “This post is in no way political in nature.”

I dunno about that: “Is this legal? It is definately an unsanitary, safety hazard. What can we do to clean this up?”

The part where you asked, “What can we do to clean this up” makes me think, “Politics!” Also, “Is this legal?”: Should it not be? Again, “Politics!”

jsb wrote, “But some friendly advice…when commenting on someone else’s blog, keep your comments brief, concise and on-topic. Otherwise you lose the audience after the first or second paragraph.”

When I post lengthy diatribes I am well aware that many will not care enough to read the whole thing. With that in mind, I make sure that when I do type up a really long reply it is specifically written for an individual (rampant).

-Riskable
http://riskable.com
“I have a license to kill -9″

Has anyone else gone and talked to the man? He’s a drunk. Nice guy, loves to talk… alot. He’s a person. He created (presumably) the problems he has. Agreed, he shouldn’t be allowed to live where he is. I don’t have answers, but I can simply say, I just want to live a happy and peaceful life in my neighborhood. That includes not having to encounter this guy and his friends. He’s not a threat, just gross because of the dirt and smell. A guy waving a towel does not make him have tourette’s, which I saw no indication of in my interaction with him. Rant about society, but if you don’t touch it, then shut up! Your empty, very verbose, commentary does nothing but put your opinion out to the world and we don’t care what you think if you aren’t doing something about it.

How this became such a politcal thread, i’ll never know. I don’t see the topic being of a political nature any more than anything else thats been on urbanjacksonville. Sure, you can pull any problem or issue into politics if you try, but that certainly isn’t necessary (therefore there’s an agenda, especially when a comment is made stating “a new round of Democrats will soon be elected and social issues will once again be a focus” *pukes*). As far as raising the minimum wage goes, I guess you would feel that a small business has lots of excess money to where they can afford to increase their employees salary across the board? Or maybe, you would like the government to supplement their income to do this so it doesn’t affect the cost to their consumers? Thats what we need, more taxes right?

“Agreed, he shouldn’t be allowed to live where he is. I don’t have answers, but I can simply say, I just want to live a happy and peaceful life in my neighborhood. That includes not having to encounter this guy and his friends. He’s not a threat, just gross because of the dirt and smell.”

How about he and his kind were there before you decided that you wanted cheap rent and the cred of living in an edgy neighborhood?

Maybe, before you gentrify the neighborhood into a nice metrosexualopolis you might want to ask your parents why they raised you in Mandrian instead of downtown?

In reference to the comment left by Whatever, I have talked to this man, and, yes, he is a nice man. As stated above, he is just an old drunk. He is refered to as “Santa Claus” by many of the other gentlemen that also inhabit the Thrid and Main Street area. Alot of these people will not go to the designated homeless shelters in town due to the fact that you cannot drink or be drunk and go there. Most of the people I have met there are in fact very nice people, and everyone has a story. Alot of people who, over years of progressive alchoholism, find themselves in a position where getting back on thier feet and leading a normal life seems like an impossible task. It becomes the norm to be where they are. There are many groups in the Springfield area that provide help to people who want to start over, and many dedicated and compassionate people within these organizations who will do what they can. But, when it comes down to it, some people just do want to change for reasons of thier own. But, that is no reason, in my opinion, to see them as anything other than just that, people.

I work with a perfect cross section of these people every day. I started out with a lot of compassion and with great intentions but over the years found out the truth. That 9 out of 10 of these people are crackheads who are not nice people, people who are capable of doing very bad things when it serves their habit. This pleasant fantasy about these sweetly hobo “santa clauses” is totally naive. Most of the homeless I have to deal with all day are opportunists, people who leetch on to a system that enables them to smoke crack all day long and give absolutely nothing in return. And that is truly what they do. They have NO intentions of taking advantage of the HUGE amount of services that are available to them. Sorry to be the downer. Damn I sound like a republican.